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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 10:04 pm Reply with quote Back to top

If you people are trying to create modifiers. Why don't you guys work together and make a new Axis and Allies 2 huh? With better support at least and maybe build your own company. Wouldn't that be a good idea?
 
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:48 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Planetshakers wrote:
If you people are trying to create modifiers. Why don't you guys work together and make a new Axis and Allies 2 huh? With better support at least and maybe build your own company. Wouldn't that be a good idea?


Well there is the whole legal issue. You have to buy the rights, get a team together, etc.

If I were the creative director of a A&A 3 (First one was 1998, then the 2004), I would give more focus on the Axis campaign. We have too many WWII games and we've played D-Day way too many times. Although they would be featured, since it is historical, I would make the Axis campaign much more interesting. All A&A does is really give us a few original missions with mostly redone Allied missions for the Axis (Like D-Day). For cinematics, I would go the Command and Conquer route and get real actors for briefings and then use cg for battle intros. The goal is to make the player feel like a German in the German campaign, an American in the American campaign, etc.

I would also place more focus on faction uniqueness. All the factions in A&A feel like copies, so I would change that. I would also make Germany, Japan, America and Russia the main factions, with Great Britain, China, and Italy as minor factions (Not as well developed as the main factions, but they do play a role in the campaign).

For the campaign, there should be limited strategic options. Instead of one battle after another, the player is given a theater (Africa for example) and can choose three battles. Only three battles are available but the player has a choice of what order to play them. So for the German campaign, if you choose the invasion of Malta first, you will receive sea reinforcements during the other missions.

The Axis campaign end with the occupation of all of Europe and Jpana's occupation of the entire Pacific. AMerica is the last nation standing. Then for the expansion pack, which assumes the Axis viictory (We already have enough Cold War turns hot games for the Allied victory), then the player chooses either Japan r Germany. The first missioons in the campaign deal with the destruction and occupation of America, then a war between Japan and Germany (Since Hitler's viision is a world led by Aryans. Politically incoorect, yes, but I would portray it as historically accurate as possible as if it did happen - even though it didn't happen obviously. Plus, if the game gets bad publcity for this, its okay, since any bad press is good press). Then whichever side you play on takes over the world, essentially.
 
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:40 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Interesting but what I would do is try to make the missions more longer like what you said an extension pack would be perfect. Submarines, destroyers, patrol boats, and minesweepers should be added to the fleet other than battleships and aircraft carriers. There are national advantages found in the Axis and Allies Game board itself. Mainly all of the countries should be found there. Isn't Great Britain a key Allied power they were the ones defending their homeland?? In the Battle of Britain??We could also add new generals too such as Douglas MacArthur , and more generals that this game didnt include.
 
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 10:33 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I heartily agree with the inclusion of Italy and China-- I was just looking into what Chinese units I'd like to work on later-- and golly, have they got a mind-bending hodge-podge of hand-me-downs! a crazy mix of American, British, German, and Russian gear.

I've even picked four generals out (granted, two are Nationalist, and two are Communist) figured I could creat a new Russian faction for West China and have that be the Red Army)-- and then have the Nationalists in Eastern China... but it'll be awhile before I can get that one up to speed.

the Chinese contribution was easy to ignore-- because after the war they became Communist-- but they helped divert some 30 or more Japanese divisions in a frustrating occupation-- if those divisions had been allowed to fight the Americans the Pacific war would have probably lasted longer.

it's not technically WWII just yet, but I'd like to create a campaign mission where you play as the Chinese army at Tai-erh-Chuang and have to stop the Japanese army for taking over the provisional capital.

Manstein's capture of Sevastopol, the siege of Leningrad, Operation Ichigo, or the interesting challenge of finding a way for the Italians to not get demolished during Operation Compass! another possibility would be "the Long March" where you have to conserve the Red Army and keep it from getting annihilated by the Japanese.
 
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:23 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Yea I agree too plus you can also play as the Nationalists and Communists too in the Campaign. The Chinese armies depend on which side of equipment you get from. The Nationalists the US and Britain, and Communists the Russian gears. Japan's main goal was to destroy China but they decided to invade the whole pacific instead. Maybe we can create an extension pack like theharkonnen said. It would make an awesome version of it. Do any of you have the Axis and Allies Board game the original version?? If not I can give u all the advantages that its says in there. So that we can elaborate on the details. Plus there should be more tanks because the game have misused its some of its name on the tanks.
 
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:35 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Maybe we can also add some guerrilla forces which is mainly on the Allied sides on the front with Japan and Germany. Such as the French Resistance in Europe and some small bands in Asia.
 
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:40 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Planetshakers wrote:
Yea I agree too plus you can also play as the Nationalists and Communists too in the Campaign. The Chinese armies depend on which side of equipment you get from. The Nationalists the US and Britain, and Communists the Russian gears. Japan's main goal was to destroy China but they decided to invade the whole pacific instead. Maybe we can create an extension pack like theharkonnen said. It would make an awesome version of it. Do any of you have the Axis and Allies Board game the original version?? If not I can give u all the advantages that its says in there. So that we can elaborate on the details. Plus there should be more tanks because the game have misused its some of its name on the tanks.


I don't have the original board game, so I wouldn't know. For China, I would combine the Nationalists and Communists into one faction. The ui and everything will be nationalist, but communist forces will supplment the nationalists (Since the communists and nationalists created a United Front against Japan). This is also what I intend to do in my mod. Its easier to do it this way, anyway.

I feel that the game also was too detailed in terms of units by using real names and such. Its hard for non-WWII buffs to get into it (One reason the game did poorly probably). The standard Command and Conquer simplicity scheme should be used, with tanks being light, medium, heavy and then have some unqiue names like Panzer.

My expansion pack idea is based upon what Hitler wanted to do if he was successful, which he was going to write about presuambly in Mein Kampft 2. If you wiki the subject you'll find what I'm talking about. He envisioned a United Europe and a second war against America.
 
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:46 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Gizmotron wrote:

Manstein's capture of Sevastopol, the siege of Leningrad, Operation Ichigo, or the interesting challenge of finding a way for the Italians to not get demolished during Operation Compass! another possibility would be "the Long March" where you have to conserve the Red Army and keep it from getting annihilated by the Japanese.


I would also do a siege of Malta for Axis, Italy taking Greece rather then the Germans, the Japanese invasion of the Alaskan islands (Forgot the names), invasion of Australia. Also the defense of Moscow, since apparantly the Germans got within 20 miles of it. Also, the Battle of Kiev.

For Japan, the Rape of Nanking, the invasion of Manchuria seem good. Also, the invasion of the Phillipines.

Siege of Leningrad is an important one. Glad you mentioned it.
 
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 7:00 pm Reply with quote Back to top

interesting that you mention those particular regions:

at work, we send stuff to the Aleutians all the time-- I'm pretty sure that there were was an naval base at Adak, an air force base at Cold Bay-- and I believe the Japanese captured Sitka, Kiska, and Attu.

it's one of those things where you can't make a good map for it on A&A because you can't accurately represent the long drawn-out nature of the archipelago. I've tried alternate versions where you get that same sense of arctic island-hopping with mixed results. you have to capture multiple islands at the same time in order to succeed.

thought it would be funny to make a custom map of Unalaska and Dutch Harbor (we have a detailed map of that for work)... figured I could even litter the map with hundreds of fish and bald eagles to give it an added layer of realism (they're like seagulls up there)! this was the first major military base that the US established in the Aleutians-- the airport, naval base, army fort, and oil refinery would make for perfect campaign objectives

the attack on Dutch Harbor was meant to be a distraction for the Battle of Midway-- but it might be fun to treat it as an actualy objective for a mission. something I mean to do later when I'm not as busy.
 
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2012 2:37 pm Reply with quote Back to top

theharkonnen: I will probably send you details of it later if I can. Plus we should separate in to three regions with each of us doing the work.

I am more of writer than a game designer because I do not know how to develop with the mods and etc. But I like describing things especially in World War II. It is my favorite subject to talk about. Let's divide this category in to four categories which are Russia, Atlantic, Pacific/China, and Africa. The Italians have a disadvantage because there tanks suck and infantry are cowards. However we should not allow the Italians and Chinese play on Mulitplayer. If you guys want to you can make them online but I prefer not too.
 
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 8:49 am Reply with quote Back to top

I was reading up video games known as streamlined games. It seems that companies have been going more towards games that are accessable to everyone, so they make them easier and simplier (Also known as desouling a game by some). This explains why many games are sequels and why there is not much creativity in the industry anymore. Gaming companies today jsut want to make money. I guess this is why Atari closed...

This is a bit concerning because the strategy has worked. People are buying more games than ever , consoles are doing well, and computer games are dying off. So if a company was made today, whose goal was to make creative and very good games, would it succedd? Or must a company adapt to the current market. I, for one, haven't bought many games recently, since they all pretty much suck (Also, probably why I'm stuck playing A&A, a games that's nearly a decade old). So if a game company were to create a game with a soul, I would buy it, if the subject matter was interesting. Still, would other people, especially now that people are stuck on simplisitc games, buy it?

Take the Russian game Stalker. This FPS was under construction for years and was desouled by the company's overlord. It was still pretty good and several expansions were released. These games were better as the company was independent at this point and could do what it wanted. It had and still has a core fanbase, with many old gamers. It was not a Call of Duty rip-off, it was original. The company was making Stalker 2, but it was shut down. So here we have an example of a game company trying to make good games failing. So back to the original question, can good game companies survive against behemoths such as EA?
 
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:17 pm Reply with quote Back to top

EA is a great company but if we should think of more ideas that is creativity to show that this game can be popular. It will take time to make it renown. I agree with what you said about Atari being closed. They had a hard time when this game was produced so they had to make it easy and short. However the creators of Axis and Allies Timegate does not look forward to this game that much either. I thik people would like more money so that they could popular with all of their games such as being COD or Starcraft 2 which are the best selling games right now.

We probably need help from Timegate cause they are the ones that made this if we were ever going to make another game that will be the most popular WWII not focused on strategy, it could combine with first person shooter/ RTS. Well it would be difficult to manage one because of the cost, supporters, and etc.
 
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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 8:40 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I was also thinking that we could make a different version but it can be both RTS and first person shooter in WWII. One of them can be a game caleld Iron Grip Warload which combines both of RTS and first person shooter into one. If any guys cooperate it would might work . The advantages for the board is the link below.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/404573/a-complete-overhaul-of-national-advantages-and-res]

This is the original board game which is still pretty fun but can go for more than 1 hour to play.
 
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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 11:17 am Reply with quote Back to top

The problem with an fps/rts game is that you are essentially making two games into one. Since, you are selling really only one game, you are only making money off of the one.

This is why we don't see many games like this and the ones that do exist are essentially two half-done games.

EA a good company? They are the company all good companies fear since they will probably be bought then shutdown by their new overlords.

The link you mentioned game me some ideas for my mod. Thanks!
 
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PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2012 8:40 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Yea your welcome anytime. There is also some rapid technology in the weapons development that is similar to the board game itself.

there should be more vessels which i think it might be the hardest to generate such as submarines and destroyers. Maybe more aircraft such as the P-38 Lightning which there could be a mission where you kill Admiral Yamamoto in the Pacific.

Maybe make two games, one RTS and one FPS for the game?? That way more money can be made.
 
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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 10:08 am Reply with quote Back to top

Planetshakers wrote:
Yea your welcome anytime. There is also some rapid technology in the weapons development that is similar to the board game itself.

there should be more vessels which i think it might be the hardest to generate such as submarines and destroyers. Maybe more aircraft such as the P-38 Lightning which there could be a mission where you kill Admiral Yamamoto in the Pacific.

Maybe make two games, one RTS and one FPS for the game?? That way more money can be made.


For destroyers, I am thinking of using the battelship as a base, making it smaller, and deleting the cannons/flak, (Leaving only one or two of each).

Subs will be next to impossble. Unless, I make a completely invisible unit to similate it being underwater. Still would need torpedos though.

Two games is always better than one, though for it to be successful, it would have to have something new and very unique. I was thinking the expansion pack with an axis victory would be enough, but it is an expansion pack. We need something for the original. I was reading about warhammer 40k and found that they have a video game, where the campaign is non-linear. You pcik where to fight and depending on your choice, the missions you didn't pick become unavailable. This could crete interesting scearios for wwii.
 
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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 3:55 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Wait so you might make the battleships look bigger and destroyers smaller. I think it might be harder to generate the torpedoes and make them attack.

I also agree with the scenario about what you are talking. There could be an extension pack for both FPS and RTS. But the orignal must be RTS since it might be a popular WWII if it can be produced.
 
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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 5:19 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Planetshakers wrote:
Wait so you might make the battleships look bigger and destroyers smaller. I think it might be harder to generate the torpedoes and make them attack.

I also agree with the scenario about what you are talking. There could be an extension pack for both FPS and RTS. But the orignal must be RTS since it might be a popular WWII if it can be produced.


Essentially, yes that's my plan for the ships. I'll try doing it tomorow to see how it goes.

I think a fps where you play as a German soler would be interesting. COD did Russia and America, but never Germans or Japanese. Then we could still have an alternate Axis victory ending.
 
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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 8:58 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Ok good.
FPS for Germans and Japanese would be very unique. Maybe the scenario for it would be Germany in Stalingrad/Moscow/Battle of Bulge, Japanese in China/ Iwo Jima/ Pacific.
What about the Italians maybe they could be sub people in the game?
 
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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 10:16 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Planetshakers wrote:
Wait so you might make the battleships look bigger and destroyers smaller. I think it might be harder to generate the torpedoes and make them attack.

I also agree with the scenario about what you are talking. There could be an extension pack for both FPS and RTS. But the orignal must be RTS since it might be a popular WWII if it can be produced.


the underwater part shouldn't be too difficult, I've already accidentally put boats below the surface-- move the Z-line axis below the water-line. the problem is that making viable torpedoes is really difficult!

you can't base it on the battleship turret alone, because then it could bombard anything on the ground too-- so it would have to be modified to only target ships.

the other problem with basing it on a battleship is that it doesn't accurately reflect how subs actually attack.

the other possibility is to make an invisible carrier with invisible fighters that will just 'gnaw' away at anything it gets close to (again, you'd have to make it so that it only tagets boats). this way you wouldn't have to command the sub to attack anything specifically, it only had to get close to the target in order to inflict damage automatically. sure, it woud look crazy-- but it might work better than trying to base the submarine on a battleship.

those were some of the far-fetched ideas I considered when trying to find a way to integrate subs into the game.

the best type of sub would probably be the disposable suicide-sub. there's already an existing template for the goliath and banzai infantry units. to create a special 'banzai' sub would probably not be too difficult. you could take the doodad boats and tweak them to look more like what you would want to see.

that's all I can think of for subs right now.

hope it helps.
 
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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 4:54 pm Reply with quote Back to top

How about only making the specialized infantry available on Single Player than on single player. it would work the best.

Subs would be the best, maybe try looking how timegate made its battleship.

New ideas for new fighters?
 
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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 7:28 pm Reply with quote Back to top

there aren't any real options for 'new' fighters.

convert the Russian fighter into a P40 by reskinning
(for use in China)

convert the Bf109 into a Ki-61 by reskinning
(would be easy, and look fantastic)

you could make a couple of passable Italian fighters by reskinning them-- but otherwise the options are limited

all the other reskinning ideas are pretty unconvincing

I'm guessing that neither theharkonnen or myself has a program to allow us to create models from scratch -- and even then, there would be the process of converting them to .nif files... reskinning or modifying existing models for the game is the only way to go right now.
 
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theharkonnen
 


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 12:31 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The main problem with planes is that they are essentially one part. This means we can't add/subtract wings or propellers, which basicly eliminates all option with fighters. Plus, they can't be controlled anyway.

I recently tried using a 3d editor program to make models (Think it was gmax - its been a few months. It was free, but you had to register for it.), but I counldn't make heads or tails of it. So I gave up. Nifscope is A LOT easier to use then actual 3d editing programs I've seen. Plus, most of them are expensive. (I felt like the program was in Greek; there were words I didn't even see before).

However, i've experimenting using different parts from different units to make new ones. However, as Gizmotron said, we can't make anything new from scratch. This also makes building subs very difficult if I were to attempt it. There are so many other things I rather do anyway with the mod. I don't think subs would add that much.
 
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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 5:26 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Ok I am trying to get a video link of how they made the game. For some reason I can't find the link for it on YouTube or well.

Wouldn't a destroyer be a little bit easier than a sub because in WWII many of the destroyers were converted in to an aircraft carrier. Subs you probably can get some pictures off the internet or the one in animations if it is allowed.
 
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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 9:14 pm Reply with quote Back to top

theharkonnen wrote:
The main problem with planes is that they are essentially one part. This means we can't add/subtract wings or propellers, which basicly eliminates all option with fighters. Plus, they can't be controlled anyway.

I recently tried using a 3d editor program to make models (Think it was gmax - its been a few months. It was free, but you had to register for it.), but I counldn't make heads or tails of it. So I gave up. Nifscope is A LOT easier to use then actual 3d editing programs I've seen. Plus, most of them are expensive. (I felt like the program was in Greek; there were words I didn't even see before).

However, i've experimenting using different parts from different units to make new ones. However, as Gizmotron said, we can't make anything new from scratch. This also makes building subs very difficult if I were to attempt it. There are so many other things I rather do anyway with the mod. I don't think subs would add that much.


yep, that's why I suggested subs as a special op. within the limits of the game, that's your best option. although I do love me some mod-work, I do like to go OUT and do fun things too.

destroyers, cruisers -- all of these are within the realm of possibility. but submarines are right out!
 
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