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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 8:41 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I remember looking at the Mechanized Tank Regiment and thinking "wow, talk about useless! why would they group normal halftracks with light tanks?"

I've seen that some people have grouped tank-destroyers with light-tanks on certain mods-- adn that made sense.

another idea I tinkered with was replacing the Mech-Tank Regiment into a "Heavy Artillery Regiment". the light tanks get replaced with arty-tanks and the ordinary half-tracks get replaced by arty half-tracks.

the end result was pretty fearsome. I found that three of these regiments grouped together could rout ANYTHING within 30 seconds. even groups of elite heavy tank regiments. even after I made the buying price $350, consuming 35 units of ammo and 20 units of oil-- it seems almost too broken for game-play in normal circimstances. however, since it's all arty vehicles it's nearly helpless in close-quarters combat against medium and heavy tanks-- so you couldn't try and win a game with just this sort of regiment. not against a wise player.

I also thought about making the mechanized infantry regiment better-- and the simplest solution was to replace the machine gun infantry with mortar infantry. although I had toyed with the idea of following line-up for the Americans.

Armored Car
Assault Infantry x3
Mortar Infantry
Flamethrower Infantry
Light Tank
AT Mechs x2

it was inspired by the noticeable trend in urban combat I've seen over the years-- a combination direct fire, indirect fire, and demoralizing weaponry. this probably closely resembles the sort of units deployed by the Germans during the Warsaw Uprising in late WWII and it's similar to what I've read about the Russians doing in Grozny. any thoughts? how would these regiments do during online play? pretty badly, like most mixed units seem to do?
 
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:38 am Reply with quote Back to top

Do you know how to chose the order of the regiments? Right now rear units are in the middle when you select them. It makes no sense.

For infantry regiments, I did the following, since I hated how AT, mortar and whatever had only like two actual AT or Mortar units:

Infantry: Three machine gunners make up the rear three slots. Weaker units should be protected better from the front.

AT: Three anti-tank troops make up the rear

Mortar: Same as above, but with mortar inf.

I also had some new regiment ideas:

tank destroyer regiment:

5 anti-tank infantry, 1 co (For Russia? Britatin? Germany? Maybe I should add a couple tank destroyers? Maybe do the same for mortars and machine gunners?)

anti-air attack regiments (same as with usual anti-air tank regiments, but with medium tanks and three antiair halftracks - would have to change the formation though)

I don't know how historically accurate these would be (I know there were SS tank divisions though), but:

SS light, medium, heavy, and king tiger tank divisions (Germany has five tanks per regular regiment. So these units would have the usual four, but have better armor, firepower, etc. and be the most expensive units)

SS versions of AT, mortar, etc. More expensive obviously.

Any other ideas? I'm hoping to use up all the slots on the various HQs. They seem too empty right now.
 
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:22 pm Reply with quote Back to top

as regards the order of regiments-- my guess is that you'd have to look in Organziations/Layouts. I haven't bothered changing the layouts of regiments yet-- but I'm guessing that's where you'd find the info.

I've felt the same way about regimental layouts. I've been gradually moving the vehicles to the front of each regiment with the mixed formations. it doesn't make sense to have infantry running out in front of light tanks and get annihilated! I've tried moving units around-- but it rarely makes a difference. for some reason the infantry always closes in for the attack IN FRONT of the vehicles! this is probably because most vehicles stop in order to open fire.

the United States deployed flame tanks pretty consistently in the Pacific. the specific model number is the "M4E4-5" American flame tanks should definitely be on your list of additional regiments.

SturmPioneer-- these were supposely "elite assault combat engineer" regiments that were equipped with flamethrowers. basically, you could make an alternate engineer regiment with higher health and morale. (I gave them a faster build and repair rate than normal engineers). back them up with a pair of German flamethrower infantry and you're good to go. (the source for this regiment came from reading Bruce Gudmundsson's article in MHQ on the history of flamethrowers in action.

"Heavy AT Mech" for Japan. replace the half-tracks with tankettes to help offset Japan's woeful lack of good tanks!

I gave snipers, marines, and Heavy Infantry to every country-- it's SO EASY to dominate the infantry stage with snipers and Commandos-- that I wanted to level out the playing field. I turned marines into "melee snipers" to help offset the huge advantage that snipers have. German marines are simply called "StormTroopers" and the British version is called "Grenadier Guards". I'm eventually going to change the Japanese Commando regiment to include a Japanese version of marines. this regment has so few units in it-- that they need to have a little higher health and defense value to make them more competitive.

I gave the Germans "Volksgrenadier Regiments", they armed with a submachine gun and are the equivalent of German conscripts. some regiments did quite well, but many were simply mowed down in droves by the Russians.

might want to include the OMSBON (Spetznaz) elite mechanized infantry regiments for Russia. they hand-picked the best athletes in the country and put them in mobile regiments to fight the Germans-- kinda like a mechanized infantry regiment with SAS commandos instead of regular infantry. I decided to make them the Russian equivalent of "Marines"-- it's worked out nicely thus far.

being able to deploy light airborne tanks is something I've been working on for over a month-- but the game seems hard-coded to not let that happen. the British deployed airborne tanks
 
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:47 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Have any infantry ideas for the British? If I give everyone heavy infantry, then they will have only one special infantry, the SAS.

I was thinking of giving them the combat engineers, but then I can't do that for other factions.

I'm also thinking we should post our new unit icons, to save us time.

Here are a couple of mine: (I also colored coded all units and building icons to be faction specific. Ex. the Russian icons have a red background, instead of green, grey for Germans, Blue for Britain, Yellow-brown for Japan, and the default green for America. Let me know if you are interested.)
 
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 1:35 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Here's a couple more:
 
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:38 pm Reply with quote Back to top

some ideas for the Brits:


Grenadier Guards (they'd have higher health and morale than regular infantry)


Gurkhas (make all of these units 'stealthy', you can't replicate their knife attacks, unfortunately, so you'd probably have to use the equivalent of a marine unit. I would iimagine it's the best equivalent to British commando infantry)


Royal Marines

the RM also had a "Special Boat Service", which you can easily imagine is their counter-part to the SAS

they also had "Frogman" Commandos... but I'm not sure you could actually pull that off with the game as it is.
 
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:07 am Reply with quote Back to top

Gizmotron wrote:
some ideas for the Brits:

Grenadier Guards (they'd have higher health and morale than regular infantry)

Gurkhas (make all of these units 'stealthy', you can't replicate their knife attacks, unfortunately, so you'd probably have to use the equivalent of a marine unit. I would iimagine it's the best equivalent to British commando infantry)

Royal Marines

the RM also had a "Special Boat Service", which you can easily imagine is their counter-part to the SAS

they also had "Frogman" Commandos... but I'm not sure you could actually pull that off with the game as it is.


So for Brits, I am going to add the Irish guard and Black Watch, the marines you mentioned above, and combat engineers.

Germans get Waffen SS infantry variations of regular infantry units.

USA gets flamers, assault, rangers, and marines

Japan will get marines and imperial guard (any more ideas)

Russia gets Spetsnaz, conscripts, snipers (any ideas)

Allspecial (elite) infantry units have a camo uniform to distinguish them.
 
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:42 am Reply with quote Back to top

Some ideas:

For the British forces could be the Australians or Indians units, they played an important role in campaigns as Africa or Italy.

For the German a good idea could be the Brandenburg specials forces. Also, I would think that the german paratroops could be improved.

The USSR had a special unit for the combat from NKVD (secret service), but with a residual importance in tactical operations. The NKVD was important to maintain the red army disciplinated.

Regarding the Japanese I don´t know if you consider the marine unit as the “Tokubetsu Rikusentai”, a special units to unload in the first moment and consolidate the beach.
 
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 12:47 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I always thought it would be interesting to have a "mechanic" unit-- somebody that could help vehicle regiments heal faster-- but that's beyond my ability at this time.
 
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 1:54 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I agree with you.

Other idea could be to create special formations. For example, the German Army used many time the “Kampfgruppe”. They consisted in a combined force with different kinds of armour, vehicles, land troops etc. This formations were very flexible and fast but also with a great power to hit the enemy.
 
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 5:59 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Some more (Don't be afraif to post some of your own ones):

Also created a grendier squad which I'm proud of. Now grenades come out of the guns.
 
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:18 pm Reply with quote Back to top

the icons I have aren't particularly good-- haven't started working with my 'good' painting program yet.
 
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:51 pm Reply with quote Back to top

here's one more.
 
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:26 am Reply with quote Back to top

The icons are very good.

Other ideas for alternative regiment:

For the German Army could be the mountain troops, they play a key role during the Norway invasion and many historians consider them as elite troops. In many cases, these troops were from Austria not from Germany. Also, during the WWII some European countries participated in fighting against USSR with some divisions - Spain, Netherlands, Norway, Belgium, the Baltic Countries, France etc - although in many cases they were part of the German Army. However, other countries as Romania or Italy had their own army fighting in front. Some of them had already been create: http://www.axis-and-allies.com/ftopict-367-Forgotten-Combatants-mod.html

In the case of USSR, other alternative regiment could be the Marine Infantry. They fought in the Black Sea but also in the siege of Leningrad.

I suppose that is very difficult, but it would be interesting to have also an alternative regiment with sea units and air unit. I don´t know if you consider this aspect as a good idea or you consider that these units have a residual importance in A&A. These units could give a new dynamic.
 
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 3:18 pm Reply with quote Back to top

it's common for players to bypass every German tank prior to the Tiger in game-play... so, most game-play already focuses on mostly peripheral regiments! the more specialized regiments that would only exist in small numbers are the ones that players use to win games every day. this is why when one player spams SAS regiments the others have to spam snipers, or mortars, or what-have-you.

look at the fact that Nimitz can drop hundreds of atomic bombs in dynamic campaign play.

moving on:

I produced a PanzerGrenadier icon. I tried placing it over a regular tank icon-- but the composition was too muddled. this seems like the best compromise.

it's when considering aviation and naval units that this game REALLY comes up short. the power of strategic bombing in the game is far, far too great. carpet bombing has NEVER won a war. I say this having studied military aviation since I was a small child. yet in this game it's entirely possible to win missions using nothing but airpower (offline, against the AI, of course). that shouldn't be possible.

there isn't enough variety in terms of ships-- the most common types of boats (and submarines) don't show up... I guess you could make a "U-Boat" operation and instantly sink an enemy boat-- but that's probably about as far as you could go.
 
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:49 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Another icon.
 
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:51 am Reply with quote Back to top

I also wondered if any knew how to edit unit penalties (Snow, forest, etc.)?

I was thinking of giving Russia a less of a penalty for snow and some other things.
 
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:37 pm Reply with quote Back to top

the problem with that is the game is designed so that all units are influenced by terrain in the same fashion. you would probably have to create a new type of unit template that is called infantry2 in order to bypass that sort of thing. then you'd have to go in and edit all of the appropriate terrain files to make that functional.

I already made a modification that gives infantry a defense boost of 5 while operating in the jungle (it had previously been 4).

you'll want to look at the properties_terrain file to make that happen.

you could make the speed modifier smaller.

of course, then you'd have to go in and manually alter the unit-type for every single Russian infantry unit-- which would be quite a bit of work.

personally, I think it would be hard to pull off without overdoing it. if you could modify speed by a fractional number or decimal point (like 0.2) that'd be alright-- but the advantage would need to be slight in order for the game to be playable. otherwise all Russian infantry units would be like SAS or halftracks in the snow compared to other nations... and that could be a big game-play problem.
 
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:25 am Reply with quote Back to top

When I speak about more warships I also think of cruiser or destroyer, not only of u-boat. In my opinion they could give a more realistic game, especially in the case of combats the Pacific.

Regarding the air power I agree with you, but this power was key during the WWII in every front and maybe in almost every battle.

In any case, the icons have a great quality.
 
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 3:08 pm Reply with quote Back to top

VKleist wrote:
When I speak about more warships I also think of cruiser or destroyer, not only of u-boat. In my opinion they could give a more realistic game, especially in the case of combats the Pacific.


This requries new models, which I don't know how to do. I may learn in the future, but for now it is out of the question.

I thought of adding ships via the HQ, rather than by power, as this will make the AI build them (In theory). I'll have to experiment becasue they would have to be depolyed in the water.

I was also thinking of chemical troopers for Germany (Like US flamethrowers), as an anti-infantry unit (rather than snipers), but I don't know how historic that would be.

I have to test this, but it seems easy to add new properties to the properties_intrusic file in the Property folder. This means you can apply a new property to certain units only. For example, I want the British paratroopers to get a better stats, without affecting reguler non-airborne troops. With this, I can do this. I have to try it, but in theory, it should work.

I also have a problem. I added royal guard troops to the game that look just like British royal gaurds (red uniform, black hat thing, and while strip), but I already have the black watch as the elite infantry for Britian. Should I make the royal guard a marine unit (Which I kinda did but don't like since they can only be built from ships, meaning they won't be seen much in game - which sux since I am proud of how they look). The other option is to make them a kind of grenadier unit. Any ideas on how they should be used?
 
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:45 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I understand, I only tried to explain myself better. It could be very difficult to create new formations, especially the naval units.

Regarding chemical troopers or anti-infantry, I would create both… Very Happy but If I had to choose, I would take the chemical troops.

As a response to the last question, I would create the royal guard.

Congratulations for the work!!!
 
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 10:01 pm Reply with quote Back to top

you can create the effect of bayonet usage in non-marine infantry units. I have a "Storm Trooper" regiment that has a full complement of 6 bayonet-wielding soldiers backed up by two machine gun units. I think all you need to do is remove the required property of "marine deployment" technology on the indvidual unit and it seems to work just fine on regular infantry.

all of the major Western participants in WW2 appear to have avoided using chemical weapons as much as possible. I learned that the United States had dedicated chemical weapons mortar and artillery regiments but never put them into action.

Japan is the only major participant in WW2 I can think of with numerous documented usage of chemical weapons in the more traditional sense: aka poison gas or biological weapons.

napalm and white-phosphorous are already covered in the game to some extant.

speaking of which, I had been planning on a special American mortar regiment that uses white-phosphorous shells that inflict flame damage instead of explosive damage-- this was based on reading about chemical mortar regiments in the US order of battle for WW2. since poison gas was studiously avoided in Europe-- this is probably the most common sort of "chemical weapon" that would be used.

speaking of which, the Brits and Americans issued quite a few white phosphorous grenades... they mostly went to the Home Guard units in England as potential AT weapons. still-- might be a fun twist to give on some of the new regiments.

I've been trying to find a way to have multiple grenade types for grenadier infantry-- but that has failed thus far. so I created an alternate grenade ability template with a little over half the recharge time-- to make the panzer grenadiers live up to their name-sake a little more.
 
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:51 am Reply with quote Back to top

Yeah, to make different grenadier types, I just copied and pasted the hand grenade ability in the ability_aa.tgi. andrenamed the second to blahblah_2 (If memory serves).

Flame mortar infantry are an excellent idea. I might add that.

Are you planning on releasing a mod when you're done? Hate to be stealing your ideas and releasing them as my own if you are planning to.

I'll give the chem troops to Japan and then chemcial bombers.

Speaking of reality, I don't recall Germany having aircraft carriers (Same for Russia). Did they have them or is that just for the game?
 
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:37 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Germany had only one carrier, but it never entered in action. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_aircraft_carrier_Graf_Zeppelin)
The main part of Kriegsmarine was the U-Boats, cruisers, destroyers etc. The German´s U-boats had a spectacular success during the war, especially during the first 2-3 years of the WWII. German´s strategy was more “continental”, many historians argue that it was a great failure and maybe the reason of the German defeat.

However, EEUU or Japan had different kind of carrier with different characteristics. In my opinion it is normal, because the war in the Pacific´s Islands could had only developed with a strong navy. The British also had many carriers, but they dedicated them, mainly, to defend the convoys with supplies in the Atlantic Sea against the U-boat´s menace.
 
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:56 pm Reply with quote Back to top

having done some more research on the use of white phosphorous it turns out that only some 20 percent or so of the rounds used were of this type-- so it might be more "realistic" to use it as an researchable technology for American mortars and artillery. since the Americans don't have improved mortar tech upgrades... that might be good. since the US already has nearly all of the best arty-upgrades it seems better to have phosphorous be a seperate artillery unit. but to be an upgrade for mortars. I was thinking of saving the phosphorous mortar infantry as a special Marine Infantry Artillery regiment.

changing gears completely...

I was thinking,it might be fun to reskin the German carrier and pass it off as the Soryu (or some other more suitable Japanese carrier).

I do plan on releasing the mod someday-- but wouldn't be bothered if you used a bunch of my ideas. just give me a nod in the "Read Me" and that'll be enough. people can see my posts here and get the idea...
 
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